Can't believe it, shouldn't happen...
Original Poster: Gazelle
Forum: Filipino Kail Escrima Martial Arts
Posted On: 16-03-2007, 07:16
Orginal Post: Gazelle: I looked at this empty forum, and thought, 'no way can this forum just be 'empty'', and decided to change it.
So, what better way to start a forum off by some questions? Of course another great way is by actually delivering information, the problem is, i know even less about Filipino martial arts than Chinese martial arts - i know, scary.
Right, so, here we go....
Does anyone know about the history of the Filipino martial arts? How did they start? Is there more than one kind? If there is more than one, are they completely independent, or derived from the same origin as others? What kind of techniques do they 'specialise' in? i.e. Judo groundwork, kickboxing kicking and punching...
There is an Escrima club here. I checked out there site, might try it out once this side of mine is healed...sounds like it could be good.
Post: JRW:
This link from wikipedia gives som information about FMA http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filipino_martial_arts
IKAEFs website http://www.ikaef.com/
I belive I once heard that there were over 1000 different styles in the Philippines.>
Post: zefff:
People on here like DAMAGE and especially Lakan_Sampu(?) can maybe give you loads of background info on the origins of FMA when they come across this thread. Lakan already had a few threads on the old forum where he discussed things like the weapons, history and heros of FMA. There are thousands of arts which cover everything from swords (double and single handed), various knives, sticks (various lengths), staff, spear, whip, thrown objects, Philipino boxing and joint manipulations (known as Pangamut, Panantukan and Dumog), groundwork with and without weaponry etc, etc.
In your area, if you are interested in starting Kali/Arnis/Escrima I suggest you begin with Warriors Escrima which IMHO is the best in UK: http://www.krishnagodhania.org/schools.html
Say goodbye to your manicure though :D Warriors is a blended system of all arts studied by Grand Master Pasa - IIRC, Balintawak, Doce Pares (famous Canete family), Excalibur system, various Pangamut and many others. It is not sport so if you go there dont expect sports!>
Post: Gazelle:
lol. I've never had a manicure in my life...and, i keep my nails short, so, should be ok in that department:).
I'll check it out, thanks, that is, after this side has healed enough...i'll check out the site to see if i think it'll be ok, but, from what i read about the escrima on campus, it sounded like it would just agrivate it...we shall see:). Seems a shame not to make the most of it if it is one of the best places:).
Thank you, that was a very helpful post. And, good to know that there are over 1000 styles:) Wow, that is a lot....>
Post: Kali:
Hi Gazelle, I can tell you personally that Krishna's one of the nicest guy's I have ever had the pleasure of learning from. Are you based in the UK?? If so, you can contact Krishna and he will put you in touch with a nearby club.>
Post: Gazelle:
That's good to know...i'm in the University of Warwick, living on campus at the moment. But i currently have a side injury, though it's acting rather bizarre, and seems to be getting better in some ways, i'm not sure if it's good for me to get back down to doing some martial arts, or not...>
Post: lakan_sampu:
My undergraduate thesis which I finished a month ago discussed Arnis since my topic is about my co-members at IPMAF.
History? There are hardly written records about that because my ancestors did not find it necessary to write about such way back then. However, there are some points that I know.
The geographic location of the natives way back influenced their movement and weapons that were used in FMA. People from the northern part of the Philippines (not yet a nation way back then) usually have "softer styles" which utilized quick footwork and circular movements. Natives from the south use more direct styles with linear and direct movements. Through frequent contacts with other people, particularly from Borneo, these styles blended into other ones.
Lapu-lapu, the first recorded Filipino hero, displayed their fighting prowess to Magellan when he landed in Mactan. They used bladed weapons (kampilan, itak etc.), knives (punal,balaraw) bows and arrows (pana, palaso), spears (sibat or sangkil), axes (palakol) and shields (karasak). What they used in daily work in the fields and forests they also wielded in war. So, ancient FMA=culture (you could also search "weapons of moroland" in yahoo). Of course Magellan died there at Mactan island in the hand of Lapu-lapu's army.
Years later, when the Spaniards were able to conquer the Philippines (except Mindanao for it is a muslim region where the fiercest native warriors resided), they outlawed the practice of the ancient arts in fear of it being a tool for rebellion, which of course, happened all the same about 200 years later. But my ancestord never stopped practicing such. Movements were blended with folk dance, improving footwork and speed. Many rebellions still trained in various styles in secret. They usually utilized the bolos and machetes in training for these bladed weapons are their tools in the farms also. Those masters who have the luxury of learning arnes, a spanish style of fencing, incorporated some movements. Hence, the word "Arnis" was derived. Of course, the people of Muslim Mindanao improved too because they were preparing for a civil war to happen against the Spaniards.
Empty-hand styles were also rediscovered like Panuntukan (fist fighting), Sikaran or Panadyakan (kicking) and Dumog (Grappling).
When the civil war broke out in the late 1800s, many revolutionaries like Andres Bonifacio, a master of the style Balintawak, fought the Spaniards with his army using bolos and machetes. They specialized in ambushes so that they can be advantageous over the enemies' firearms. Some natives also fought like the Aetas and Ifugaos (remember the head-hunters?). The efficiency of the Filipino fighting arts was tested in these occasions.
In the modern times, training in the FMA was systematized. Rattan canes were used extensively to avoid injuries since bladed weapons were too dangerous to train with. Footwork and movement is fundamentally the same with weapons or without. Locks, catch-and-strikes and disarmings were developed too in Modern Arnis.
What I like with FMA is that one trains with canes first. Hence, when training with empty hand, it is easier to defend because of the background in defending against weapons. You already consider your training partners' limbs as weapons, one might say.
Gazelle's question is very general IMO. You could specify some for me to elaborate more at the extent of my current knowledge in FMA... :)>
Post: Gazelle:
Thank you very much.
Was martial arts something everyone learned?
Did FMA evolve out of immediate neccesity, caution, or entertainment/interest?
Is it now practiced widely again?
Obviously things evolved during the Spaniards domination, and, that in itself can imply loss, loss of a past form, that is, but, was there a great many techniques/systems that were literally completely lost, do you judge? I don't know how able people were to carry on in secret, so, that's why i ask...
And, of course i recall the headhunters!lol
What did you study, then, if you did an undergraduate thesis on Arnis?>
Post: lakan_sampu:
It depends on the tribe. There are instances when even women leaders called "babaylan" do not only perform priestess' duties but also they serve as warriors too, such is the simple division of labor at those times. As far as I've read and know, almost all male tribe members learn "pananandata" (warrior arts) with weapons from their everyday work.
I really do not think it came out of interest, I think it is more on necessity and caution for there is a constant threat of domination from other warring tribes even in peaceful areas.
"Is it now practiced widely again?" - I really did not understand this question, maybe because I'm slightly tipsy at this moment... xp
Many styles were lost, especially in the Souther Luzon and Visayas regions because the concentration of the Spanish regime was there. Partly because many were blended with spanish fencing. However, the ones in Mindanao were able to retain there direct and linear styles that use shields, spears etc. aside from long knives or swords. The spanish hardly penetrated the region due to the hostility of the Muslim natives to Christians.
My thesis title is "A Descriptive Study of the Life-World of Selected Members of the International Philippine Martial Arts Federation". I only validated Alfred Schutz's phenomenology, particularly the concepts of umwelt and mitwelt, on the context of my respondents from IPMAF. Its not really on the art but on the members of the said martial arts organization.>
Post: Gazelle:
Hmmm...very interesting....thank you. I shan't ask anything more at the present time:), other than, what the heck does 'unwelt' and 'mitwelt' mean?lol.>
Post: lakan_sampu:
Umwelt is Schutz's concept of "we-relationship" it is basically characterized by closeness, intimacy, and immediacy. The other, mitwelt, is the "they-relationship" which is characterized by distance, indifference and anonimity.>
Post: Gazelle:
Cool.
So, you looked for these concepts in the IPMAF for your thesis, among other things?>
Post: lakan_sampu:
Yes. I looked for the members' patterns of behavior that I could categorize as umwelt and mitwelt. I found out that learning in the dojo is affected by the degree of their closeness to each other.>
Post: Gazelle:
Cool. Was it an interesting study to do? Sorry, i seem to be getting a bit distracted. I'll concentrate on the Philipino MA's from now on! Though, now, i need to get on with some work...a lot to do today.>
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