Lion's Claw Kung Fu?
Original Poster: BLACK PANTA
Forum: Kung Fu Styles, Chinese Martial Arts
Posted On: 29-07-2006, 23:50
Orginal Post: BLACK PANTA: http://www.lionsclawkungfu.com/history.htm
Have anyone heard of this style. Is it a legit style?
Post: setsu nin to:
Sijo Lee J is Lee Jones, guy who studied many styles but didnt master any and in the end finde his own style. One morning he was some low rank Lee Jones, same day afternoon he become Sijo Lee J... its magic...>
Post: BLACK PANTA:
I figured it was bullshit...what's with the title Sijo btw...I have never heard of that title.>
I have heard of Lion being refered to as an internal form of Tiger, but that's different from this dude's thing. Anyone else heard of this? KF guys?>
Post: setsu nin to:
Sijo is founder of the style, sometimes main person in some style (something like Japanese soke) or teacher of teachers teacher. Anyway, its something that Lee Jones can just dream about.>
I decided to research the topic, and this is my explanation. China hadn't heard of lions until about a thousand years ago. They believed that the tiger was the ruler of the animal kingdom, much like the West considered the lion to hold the same title. Martial arts-wise, I know that the lion isn't one of the five Shaolin animals (tiger, leopard, crane, snake, and dragon). If there IS a lion style, I think it's probably a combination of something like tiger and leopard. You'd have to ask Bloody to get the truth.>
Stazzy>I had heard what you are saying, to the Chinese the Tiger was THE big cat, and why the difference between denoting Tiger and then the smaller cats (Leopard).>
First, there is no Lion style in Chinese martial arts that I am aware. The tiger was and is the symbol of instinctual strength to the Chinese while the mythical dragon combines the tiger's strength with wisdom to become an even more powerful symbol and martial art. Samurai, the leopard is one of the five derivatives of Five Animal style (some call it choy li fut in Southern style vernacular) and is distinctive in that the hand is held differently. While the tiger claw is represented by all five fingers being open from the palm and bent to use as a ripping motion on bone, tendon, and muscle (and in hung gar, the tiger rips low while the crane strikes high, as the classics state), the leopard's hand is where all the first knuckles of the five fingers are forward and the rest of the finger to the fingertips are tucked to the palm. Also, the leopard fist will move a little more from side to side while striking.
Of the twelve animals of Shaolin and the five animals of choy li fut, the tiger is considered the most powerful in its striking and also one of the least cunning/more instinct.
Hope this helps.
Great to be just discussing martial arts again.>
One other comment....in late Chinese history, the Lion of course became reknowned for lion dancing symbolically and also as a symbol of royal strength in the North. However, I know of no system or style for this animal, but I may be wrong.>
Thanks Bloody, any of you KF guys probably already know this stuff, but I found this website for Shaolin Australia where they took the aspects of Tiger, Leopard, Crane, and Snake and broke them down in terms of psychology. Most of the stuff on the site is utter crap, but their sections about the animals was actually pretty cool. About half way down is where the behavioral models start, and the icons to the right give more indepth on each model/style. Bloody or NB or any of you KF guys check it out, and tell me what you think of it.
Post: BLACK PANTA:
BB TMK there are only 5 animals in Shaolin KF.
Tiger Power, and Directness
Panther/Leopard, Dexterity, Agility
Dragon, I always forget this one...DAMMIT
The other animals were additions/developements/fusions on the base 5>
BP, as far as Five Animals, I believe the original you mentioned are absolutely correct from the pespective of the Henan Temple and other Northern influences during the original animal creations. As you state, I concure that later certain animal styles like preying mantis, bak lum snake, monkey, etc. were added to the Shaolin zoo afterwards and trained with Shaolin lo han exercises, nei gung breathing techniques, along with the 18 weapons of Shaolin later incorporated as extensions to the empty hand defense to fight the Manchu.
Good point BP.>
Dragon is instinct with wisdom added, at least that is the usual propagation.>
Post: BLACK PANTA:
Must be said that tiger, Panther, Snake, Crane and Dragon are not only ways to strike or make your fist. The animals are also combat philosophies. The tiger, can be seen very much in Shotokan and Kyokushing Karate. These are direct and agressive styles. All animal styles of Kung Fu, White Crane, White tiger, Black Dragon, Choy Li Fut, even Wing Chun must incorporate all 5 animals however they focus more on one animal's characteristic.>
Amen BP....the original Shorin ryu comes from the Japanese word for Shaolin in Okinawa, where a Henan monk migrated. As an example and in support of what BP stated, the crane and attitude there of is pervasive in most Janpanese ryu systems and Hawaiian Kempo practice, re William Chow, Alfredo Emperado, etc. And, in order to actually run the forms and fight appropriately, a basic Shaolin methodology is to assume the animal attitude of the species one is imitating. That is why anyone who has seen me run a Ying Jow eagle form, Wudan Shaolin Nine Bird form, or white crane in competition when I competed always compared my movement and spirit to a bird attacking prey in some form or fashion.
Live the animal you fight with!!! Thanks BP for the complementary commentary to my own. Always cool when we can act as each other's reference point...LOL.>
Thanks guys, very interesting and enlightening to read.>
If you think it's interesting to read about BB's animal styles, just wait till he uses some of them on you.
Oh by the way...I am getting better and better at digging into the back of Raymond's arm. :lol: All of his muscle mass makes it easier for me to use my forearms against him. If I ever expect to win a fight against a person as big as he is, I have to be able to manipulate their entire body through whatever means necessary, and that's why I love Kung Fu.
Nbotary never comes around anymore, but I understand he has a lot of stuff going on in his life such as his newborn sith lord. Grats btw if I never said it explicitly. If you ever decide to come back, I'd love to test out a couple of techniques that Dawei, Michael, and Kevin have been helping me improve.
I just got back from Schlitterbahn water park in Galveston, so I'm a bit tired and I won't be posting too much more tonight. I had to do all the driving. :cry: Oh well. Big slides, girls in bikinis, and free food...what more could a 17-year-old ask for?>
Sliding down with the girls in the bikinis with food and phone numbers at the end!! :lol: :wink: And, at 17, a hot car to take those bikini girls as you drive down the beach highway afterwards with the top down (car, not girls, at least not until later....lol).>
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